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Grinding The Starting Material Up Or Not?

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#1 McKinnon

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Posted 18 May 2012 - 04:50 PM

Hi my friends. If I´m not wrong, I´ve read that Rick Simpson says you must NOT grind the starting material up, what do you think? why is this? best
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#2 Turf

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Posted 18 May 2012 - 05:10 PM

the finer you grind that material... the harder it gets to filter out my twocents.gif
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#3 mediuseA

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Posted 18 May 2012 - 11:17 PM

Methinks its about not destroying the trichs and hten mixing em with tiny particulate matter...? muA
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#4 Graywolf

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Posted 19 May 2012 - 07:01 AM

It increases the availability of non active ingredients for extraction at the fractured edges and increases the fines that have to be filtered out. If you are using a non polar solvent like butane or hexane, the first doesn't make a lot of difference. If you are using a polar solvent like alcohol, it does. Instead of grinding, we scrub our through a 10 mesh screen to remove the lumber and size the material for efficient column packing. Things like food processors and coffee grinders produce excessove fines.
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#5 mediuseA

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Posted 19 May 2012 - 08:15 AM

Hehehe...always a pleasure to learn more with you around GW :D muA
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#6 McKinnon

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Posted 19 May 2012 - 11:23 AM

:I agree: I really enjoy each of your answers bigsmileythumbsup , so much knowledge... GW, what kind of fines are we talking about? Peace
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#7 mediuseA

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 02:27 AM

Fines are basically any small particle...be it leaf, stem or other small particulate matter. muA
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#8 Graywolf

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 09:40 AM

I define fines, as any particle small enough to make it through my primary coffee filter. We have vacuum filtered them with a Number 1 Wattman lab filter, and then through a 0.2 micron filter to remove them, but it is just more work.
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#9 McKinnon

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Posted 20 May 2012 - 12:12 PM

Ok, I get it. thank you both med and gray!!! one last question about it please. How harmful may theses fines be for the patient? what are the risks?
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#10 Graywolf

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 09:44 AM

Ok, I get it. thank you both med and gray!!! one last question about it please. How harmful may theses fines be for the patient? what are the risks?


They are just plant particulate, so non toxic. Mostly they make the oil harsher to smoke or vaporize and it doesn't look as pristine.

They reduce potency by their actual percent of volume.

It may make the oil less tasty orally, but raw cannabis oil isn't all that tasty anyway by itself.

If there is enough chlorophyll present, some patients may experience gastric distress, but that is usually dissolved and not in the form of particulate.

About all that I can think of at the moment.
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#11 McKinnon

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 10:16 AM

They are just plant particulate, so non toxic. Mostly they make the oil harsher to smoke or vaporize and it doesn't look as pristine.

They reduce potency by their actual percent of volume.

It may make the oil less tasty orally, but raw cannabis oil isn't all that tasty anyway by itself.

If there is enough chlorophyll present, some patients may experience gastric distress, but that is usually dissolved and not in the form of particulate.

About all that I can think of at the moment.


GW, you are a great master!

Peace 4 all
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#12 Graywolf

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 08:44 AM

GW, you are a great master!

Peace 4 all


Thanks for the good thoughts, but if I'm a master of anything, including me, we are all in deep doo..........................................

Peace!
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#13 mediuseA

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 11:39 AM

I can grow weed with doo, GW... :D muhahahaa muA
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#14 Itinkso

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 12:55 PM

I can grow weed with doo, GW... :D muhahahaa
muA


i grow doo masquerading as weed!!!
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#15 mediuseA

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 01:55 PM

Been there, schmoked th@ :passit: muA
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#16 co2xtractr

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 01:36 AM

Thanks for the good thoughts, but if I'm a master of anything, including me, we are all in deep doo..........................................

Peace!

lol, I like your posts very much gw.

#17 co2xtractr

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 02:07 AM

here I will say, that I dust my matrix very fine, making sure the divisions are equal as can be. doesnt work out that way, but its pretty well dusted. by increasing the surface area, you allow the solvent to penetrate easier by not having certain areas more dense than others. where the solvent will have surface tension to overcome, by dusting the matrix, that surface tension is pretty much uniform and isnt of different shapes or sizes. i like to get all the stems out or even try a hemp filter from the stems fibers. but feel there isnt any use for there presence in the matrix. tiny ones get by, but gross ones are weeded out. now the filtration has to be worked a bit when dusted, or expect a darker extract, where as fine particles get by and evenly turn the extract uniformly dark vs w specs of plant matter. perhaps thats what gw is talking about the non-polar not affected by fine divisions, vs the polar solvents being affected? maybe thats why my extracts have been taking on a darker color lately? i though nothing of it, leaving the extracts speak for themselves, but maybe i wont try dusting it only crushing it instead and every other condition kept the same.

#18 Graywolf

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 07:15 AM

I've found that heating the material in an oven at 200F until it is just frangible when rolled between the finger and thumb, and then scrubbing it through a 10 mesh screen using firm pressure and a leather glove, sizes it and removes the lumber, without excessive fines. You might give that a shot, but don't dry to the point that it is brittle, or you will end up with lots of fines.

We are looking at alternative methods that are less labor intensive, but so far none of the conventional grinders have worked out as well. I am considering making a large grinder with a crank or motor, based on the design of a simple hand grinder. That wouldn't take out the lumber, but would give a uniform size without excessive fines.
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#19 mediuseA

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 07:41 AM

GW....would sommat like an old crankshaft for an engine inna tube with the prerequisite distance between the tube and the knobby bits O the crankshaft work for getting the size ya after? hmmm

Posted Image
Sommat along these lines might be constructed from wood pieces offset on a metal crankshaft?.....a hybrid of crankshaft, offset pear-shaped pieces and screw mechanism to move the material forward? a rake like mechanism rotating on the shaft to remove the lumber might also work perhaps?
muA
Here's sommat I knocked up on mediCAD :P hehehe
Attached File  1.JPG   89.85KB   3 downloads

Has anyone considered using sonic cleaning based equipment to remove trichs from cannabis cleanly? hmmmmm thinking.gif
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