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Decarboxylation


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#1 Graywolf

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 08:38 AM

Herefile:///C:/DOCUME~1/User/LOCALS~1/Temp/msohtml1/01/clip_image001.jpg is a handy time and temperature graph for decarboxylating cannabis.

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#2 mediuse

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 08:56 AM

GW...I d/l it and opened with wordpad....the doc is all in gibberish....am I doing something wrong? muA
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#3 Bueller

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 09:03 AM

muA... try MS Word.... Pete
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#4 mickrick

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 09:24 AM

it says i need a 25 digit code.. mick.
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#5 mediuse

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 09:38 AM

Do I have to install msword?....I really hate it muA
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#6 Graywolf

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 10:04 AM

Do I have to install msword?....I really hate it

muA


Try this PDF file:

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#7 mediuse

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 10:27 AM

Thanks GW...now I can read it:) The 3, 5, 10 and 15 on the verticle axis..wh@ do they represent? muA
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#8 Graywolf

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 03:08 PM

Thanks GW...now I can read it:)

The 3, 5, 10 and 15 on the verticle axis..wh@ do they represent?

muA


Miligrams per gram of THC.
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#9 mediuse

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 04:22 PM

Once again...thanks:) muA
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#10 Itinkso

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Posted 12 July 2010 - 06:37 AM

cool GW!!!....thanks muchly for that!!!
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#11 eloquentsolution1

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 02:45 AM

hey, graywolf. tell them how you decarboxylate in your cannabis kitchen.
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#12 jangel

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Posted 21 September 2010 - 06:51 AM

Hey Eloquentsolution! Nice to see you here sweetie. Take care.
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#13 eloquentsolution1

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 12:33 AM

Hey Eloquentsolution! Nice to see you here sweetie.

Take care.


nice to be back on line.
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#14 froggymountain

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Posted 13 February 2011 - 10:38 PM

File opens in Word or Open Office (Open Office is Free). For Open Office is is best to right click and "save target as" and download the document to then open in Open Office.
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#15 froggymountain

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Posted 13 February 2011 - 10:45 PM

Is the higher THC % at higher temperatures a result that many of the light fractions are eliminated that the overall % by volume or mass for THC increases? Such high temperatures are very interesting, almost counter-intuitive at least to most botanical extract methods - since light fractions such as bioflavonoids, phytonutrients et al survive only lower temperature exposure.
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#16 Turf

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 12:55 AM

i am curious about the process. could you simply heat up the oil at the end of the solvent removal for say 7 minutes to the required temperature. or is there a time compnent between the oil manufacture and decarboxlation? could you microwave?Posted Image

Edited by TurfScience, 14 February 2011 - 02:15 AM.

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#17 eloquentsolution

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 05:05 AM

i am curious about the process. could you simply heat up the oil at the end of the solvent removal for say 7 minutes to the required temperature. or is there a time compnent between the oil manufacture and decarboxlation? could you microwave?Posted Image


i would never microwave. temps are not even.

decarboxylation happens with time and temperature. gw has posted a graph giving those precise parameters. check his posts. interestingly, the oil will not heat beyond the boiling temp of the solvent then water (if present) until they are eliminated.

if you are vaporizing or smoking the oil, decarboxylation is not necessary...only if ingesting do you need to remove the acid. smoking and vaporizing take care of that in the process of high temp heating. i have also routinely decarboxilated topical concoctions, though skunk pharmers are not in agreement as to the need for decarboxylation in topical application.

hope these comments helped you.
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#18 kittypup

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 07:30 AM

Thanks again GW and EL for all the great info and knowledge you share.
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#19 eloquentsolution

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 04:22 AM

you are surely welcome. happy to help where ever i can!
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#20 Janne

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Posted 22 March 2011 - 08:36 PM

Thank you my friends, very interesting information. :D I`ll make oil quite soon. So, what temperature and time you people would recommend for oil that will be used orally for cancer? Can I decarboxylate dry material or is it better to do it for oil afterwards?
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#21 Graywolf

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Posted 23 March 2011 - 05:39 AM

hey, graywolf. tell them how you decarboxylate in your cannabis kitchen.



I decarboxylate two ways on each batch of oral meds. Curing and every heat process you subject the material to decarboxylates it some, so a single cook-it-this-long at this temperature recipe, is less helpful than just watching what is going on visually.

First, I dry the material in a 200F oven until frangible, before passing it through a sieve for processing. Decarboxylation is giving up water and C02, so some decarboxylation takes place at this step.

After ectraction, I place the extracted oil in a 250F oil bath to finish purging out the solvent and decarboxylating. I cook in that temperature bath until the large solvent bubbles and most of the small C02 bubbles are gone. The small C02 bubbles taper off as the available THCA drops.

The time generally follows the decarboxylation graph, depending on how much has already taken place.

I shoot for 70% decarboxylation unless I am trying to make a stony sedative medication. The peak of the THC curves on the graph that I posted, are about ~70% decarboxlated. After that point, THC is converted to CBN by the process, faster than THCA is converted to THC.

CBN is of course a sedative and continuing to cook the oil is a good way to increase the levels and tone down the THC speediness of the medication. It just depends on what you are looking for in an end product.

Edited by Graywolf, 23 March 2011 - 05:40 AM.

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#22 mainah

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Posted 26 April 2011 - 11:27 PM

GrayWolf, i'll be trying out a new coldfinger extractor tomorrow with about 14 g of NYC Diesel. since the extractor recycles the alcohol i was planning to use 1 oz per g for extraction, and should end up with nearly the same amount. i then plan to dilute it further with an equal amount of distiller water, and may add some flavorings from there or use as is. i do intend to decarb the herb in the oven first as per your instructions, but i can't very well take the alcohol up to 250, so what should i do to finish? would a water bath at 160 to 170 for an hour do it? i want it to be ready to use as is. thanks, terry
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#23 Graywolf

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 08:25 AM

GrayWolf,
i'll be trying out a new coldfinger extractor tomorrow with about 14 g of NYC Diesel. since the extractor recycles the alcohol i was planning to use 1 oz per g for extraction, and should end up with nearly the same amount. i then plan to dilute it further with an equal amount of distiller water, and may add some flavorings from there or use as is.
i do intend to decarb the herb in the oven first as per your instructions, but i can't very well take the alcohol up to 250, so what should i do to finish? would a water bath at 160 to 170 for an hour do it? i want it to be ready to use as is.
thanks,
terry


As you will note from the chart, 173F (ethanol boiling point) doesn't achieve the best THC levels, so if you wish to preserve them, you need another plan.

I can only think of three possible alternatives:

Decarb the herb before extraction.

A tricky one of decarboxylating under pressure so as to get the alcohol up to 250F.

And what I would do if I wanted to end up with an alcohol tincture, and that is to remove all the alcohol so that I could decarboxylate it at atmospheric pressure and 250F, after which I would simply add back the alcohol.

We are playing with decarboxylation by Ph adjustment, but have no test results yet.

Perhaps there is someone else on board that can think of some more tricks.
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#24 mainah

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 11:36 AM

Thank you very much for the reply first of all.

i put the dry weed in the oven at 225F for 30 min. it came out in what seemed to me a perfectly frangible state. i could easily break it up and remove stems with my fingers. i then used a space grinder to grind it up. i spent extra time upside down to get a good grind.
so far it has spent about 60 minutes at 160F in a water bath. i intend to cool it down, then repeat in 30 min increments for at least 3 cycles, then sample.
does that sound like a better plan?

you mention 250F under pressure. i have a pressure cooker. what amount of time would that take?

btw, if anyone else has any ideas please jump in by all means! i did not intend to limit this to GW and I at all. it's just that he started the thread so i thought i should ask him. sorry if that is perceived as highjacking by anyone. that is certainly not my intent.

fyi, i am currently filming this experiment with my ipod touch. i think i have about 8 - 9 min so far and i intend to start a new thread and upload it here for use if it's approved. all of your input is appreciated and any ideas may end up in the video, who knows.

well, time to go cool 'em down!

terry


As you will note from the chart, 173F (ethanol boiling point) doesn't achieve the best THC levels, so if you wish to preserve them, you need another plan.

I can only think of three possible alternatives:

Decarb the herb before extraction.

A tricky one of decarboxylating under pressure so as to get the alcohol up to 250F.

And what I would do if I wanted to end up with an alcohol tincture, and that is to remove all the alcohol so that I could decarboxylate it at atmospheric pressure and 250F, after which I would simply add back the alcohol.

We are playing with decarboxylation by Ph adjustment, but have no test results yet.

Perhaps there is someone else on board that can think of some more tricks.


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#25 mainah

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 03:40 PM

mus be workin. in the intrest of scienc i been lickin the stuff an i tink its workin! full reportr lader terry
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