Ballast feed back - GreenPassion.org - Dedicated to Medicinal Cannabis Cultivation and Education

4maggio · #1 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 08:55 AM

High all.. reciently upgraded my box and rewired it.

I have both the HID light and its' fan on a timer as before.
After about a week, the HID wouldn't come on at prescribed time but the fan would. I found that if the HID was plugged directly into the timer, it sparked up no problem. Later I tried the heavy duty extension cord (used previously) but while putting in the plug rubbed my thumb across the plug to the ballast and got a little buzz back! Should current be detected at the plug? I know it hold electricity but is this normal?

SomeDude · #2 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4maggio

while putting in the plug rubbed my thumb across the plug to the ballast and got a little buzz back!

You have a short in that cord - DO NOT PLUG IT IN UNTIL IT IS REPAIRED OR REPLACED!! Electrical Fires are real

i would just cut off both ends of that cord, toss it and get a new one

Zigzagman · #3 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 09:09 AM

I agree, you need to replace that extension cord.

tokecrazy · #4 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 10:15 AM

Also what the watts of the timer?Is timer made to run hid lights?Chech the timer and the cord going to your ballest.That little buzz back can kill you.Please check it out we like to see you around here. Peace

4maggio · #5 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 10:27 AM

Thanks everyone but the cord in question is coming from the ballast.
The extension cord I mentioned was in service, powering the ballast very well b4 I remodeled, I'm going back to it.

When I touch the prongs of the ballast plug, I get feed back.
I am prettysure a mechanical balast will store energy but it is digital 600w.

But you're right! I do not need any fires!!! That's why I'm here asking the pros opinions.

4maggio · #6 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tokecrazy

Also what the watts of the timer?Is timer made to run hid lights?Chech the timer and the cord going to your ballest.That little buzz back can kill you.Please check it out we like to see you around here. Peace

Yes toke.. I've been using the same timer for two years (changed batteries!) with no problem. Yes ballast cord is the culpret.

And hey toke... I like being here! Thanks.

justanotherbozo · #7 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 10:58 AM

high bro, it sounds to me like the plug isn't grounded properly.

if you are at all handy and it won't void your warranty, taking the case off
the ballast and checking the connections inside shouldn't be all that hard.
(be sure to unplug before doing this, lol)

btw, i'm a CFL grower with absolutely no experience with HID's so i could be
suggesting something you shouldn't do. hopefully someone else will either
support me or debunk me, lol.

(lol, i do have a couple of 150watt HPS's now that i think about it and i've
already remote ballasted one of them just to try it out, it was way easier
than you might think)

(i do have some training in electronics as well so i myself wouldn't hesitate to take
the case off and check but i don't know your level of electrical experience so be
careful and, if you have no experience, then have someone else look at it)

Zigzagman · #8 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 11:00 AM

Timers wear out way faster than most people think. I switched to mechanical timers a couple of years ago and have been trouble free ever since. Whenever the the power goes out , the timer simply picks up where it left off... electronic timers can't... huge difference if you don't see your grow daily.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4maggio

Yes toke.. I've been using the same timer for two years (changed batteries!) with no problem. Yes ballast cord is the culpret.

And hey toke... I like being here! Thanks.

4maggio · #9 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zigzagman

Timers wear out way faster than most people think. I switched to mechanical timers a couple of years ago and have been trouble free ever since. Whenever the the power goes out , the timer simply picks up where it left off... electronic timers can't... huge difference if you don't see your grow daily.

I stuck my thumb on the ballast plug again.. nada.. in hindsight, the first time I did it I jumped, 2nd not as much... 3 less.. etc..
could it have been 'residual electrical feedback'? (<< sounds absurd! LOL!!).. I will watch it for the next couple weeks..
I'm not discounting the bad ground either.. but that would require meclimbing into the box and working on the duplex box in ther that the light is plugged into.

The timer was my first thought, ZZM.. switched immediatly to a mechanical 15a HD timer... same, no light, fan ok... Plug HID in direct.. no problem..
I now have it on a Main line in > battery backup > HD extension cord (3ft) > on a splitter (Plug:HID&Fan) >the timer (I may go to the mechanical..)
turning the HID/Fan on at 1830 off at 0630 and then fingering the plug tomorrow at 0630..

I will be there at 1830 for the start of the show.. bad ground! S***!

Zigzagman · #10 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 12:18 PM

Sounds like there might be a capacitor in the ballast box. A capacitor is basically an inline battery that stores electricity, to be used to flatten out the start up demand on the light. It can give a jolt for sure...

justanotherbozo · #11 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zigzagman

Sounds like there might be a capacitor in the ballast box. A capacitor is basically an inline battery that stores electricity, to be used to flatten out the start up demand on the light. It can give a jolt for sure...

that is an excellent point Zigzagman, capacitors are often used to even
out the current flow and lower the amperage, it makes for a more efficient
use of current.

be very careful with a capacitor, it can hold quite a heavy charge and for
quite a while as well.

for those who might read this, if you have no electrical experience at all, let
someone else do this for you, even if you have to pay, you can always earn
more money but you won't be able to grow new fingers or stop the fire from
consuming your house if you do something wrong.

4maggio · #12 (**permalink**) 05-20-2009, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zigzagman

Sounds like there might be a capacitor in the ballast box. A capacitor is basically an inline battery that stores electricity, to be used to flatten out the start up demand on the light. It can give a jolt for sure...

I don't know squat about digi ballasts. I know mechanicals have a capacitor..
I'm ordering onother 600w ballast today..

Hey HidHut!

P@ssw0rd · #13 (**permalink**) 05-21-2009, 06:20 PM

I pop open magnetic ballasts all the time to change the stock cords out to spliced in extension cords, Saves me some cash. Pretty easy to navigate inside most ballasts, usually only 3 components and maybe a switch. As stated before capacitors are nasty little things and the contacts should be avoided even when unplugged to be safe.

All that being said i have never opened a digital ballast. My Lumatek says "The Lumatek uses a resin-sealed case for completely silent operation without a noisy fan." Didn't really sound user friendly to me and i never had a good reason to so i never had. My understanding is that other then a possible loose connection there are no "user servicible" components inside anyway. Not to a person of my skill anyway and i am fairly comfortable with electricity.

I would deffinetly return any piece of equipment that gave me an unexpected shock, even if just a tickle. So if still in the warranty take it back. Good Luck Stay Safe.

smoking Joe · #14 (**permalink**) 05-21-2009, 07:38 PM

For Safety all electrical equipment in a grow room should be plugged into a gfic. If there is a short it will "trip" and protect the user from a lethal shock. One last item capacitors would hold a charge. Short the leads of a capacitor together to discharge it before touching one.

P@ssw0rd · #15 (**permalink**) 05-21-2009, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoking Joe

Short the leads of a capacitor together to discharge it before touching one.

Is there a risk of explosion or rupture in doing this or is it totally safe?

4maggio · #16 (**permalink**) 05-21-2009, 08:50 PM

But I'm thinking that digi ballasts have some sort of intergrated bits, like a computer mother board (kinda). I'm not sure there is a capacitor in there.. but like you said.. take it apart and they don't want to know nuthin.

By the way, I switched to a mechanical timer plugged directly into the battery backup.. all is well.. at the moment..

SomeDude · #17 (**permalink**) 05-22-2009, 07:40 AM

There's all kinds of stuff in those digital ballasts

caerulipes · #18 (**permalink**) 05-22-2009, 10:10 AM

This thread has me reconsidering my planned investment in a digi ballast. Are the few benefits really worth the mystery filling and extra $$?

4maggio · #19 (**permalink**) 05-22-2009, 10:23 AM

The plus for the digi os that it extends bulb life and is cooler running than mechanical.. oh yes, the are smaller and lighter.. and some can do both MH & HPS...

but ya can't fixem uself.

SomeDude · #20 (**permalink**) 05-22-2009, 10:29 AM

the digital ones aren't that expensive anyway.. I paid $180 for my 600 MH/HPS ballast. Plus i don't have to worry about any 60hz HUMMMMMMMMMM from traditional ballasts too.

https://www.htgsupply.com/viewproduc...roductID=45680

https://www.hidhut.com/catalog/hid-h...s-c-21_35.html <-- $179.99

https://www.hidhut.com/catalog/sun-s...hps-p-246.html <-- $270.99

https://www.hidhut.com/catalog/sun-s...ast-p-254.html <-- $189.95