Hi,

Check out these Ph and EC readings since this morning:

Date: Thursday, October 22, 2009
Time: 9:05:04 AM
Res: DWC 1

Starting Ph - 6.45 EC - 89 PPM (9:05:04 AM)
Adjusted Ph - 5.69 EC - 314 PPM (9:15:42 AM)
Nutrients Added - Two teaspoons of FloraNova grow. (9:15:42 AM)
Checked Ph - 6.39 EC - 297 PPM (2:16:44 PM)
Adjusted Ph - 5.61 EC - 739 PPM (2:21:55 PM)
Nutrients Added - One teaspoon. I added back 1 gallon of Spring water making the overall PPM 739 (2:21:55 PM).
Checked Ph - 6.14 EC - 351 PPM (8:46:16 PM)

Res Temperature: 70 - 75
Ambient Temperatures: 77 - 79 degrees.
Relative Humidity: 42% - 46%

The Ph is going all over the place in my opinion. I understand that the Ph rises when the plants eat but I thought it was a more gradual process? I'd like to see the Ph stabilize a little bit at least. What do you think is going on? I'm using spring water in this DWC unit. I'm using tap in another unit and I'm still seeing similar Ph swings. The only difference is the PPM's have stayed the same in the other res, the plants aren't feeding at the moment.

I'm using FloraNova veg nutes right now. I'm seeing some brown rusting on a few leaf tips but nothing severe.

Thanks,

-the Corsican.

__________________
My grow journal: http://www.greenpassion.org/f24/cors...st-grow-15533/

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke.

"If at first you don't succeed, it wont hurt to smoke a little weed!"

You ppms might be too low, so the plant is eating up a bunch of acidic nutrients as soon as you give it to them. How big are the plants? How old?

If they are healthy sized plants you could try pushing them up to 850, then 900 ppms and see if the change is more gradual.


Does the brown on the leaf tips look like burn? Or like Mg def?

Date: Thursday, October 22, 2009
Time: 9:05:04 AM
Res: DWC 1

Starting Ph - 6.45 EC - 89 PPM (9:05:04 AM)
Adjusted Ph - 5.69 EC - 314 PPM (9:15:42 AM)
Nutrients Added - Two teaspoons of FloraNova grow. (9:15:42 AM)
Checked Ph - 6.39 EC - 297 PPM (2:16:44 PM)
Adjusted Ph - 5.61 EC - 739 PPM (2:21:55 PM)
Nutrients Added - One teaspoon. I added back 1 gallon of Spring water making the overall PPM 739 (2:21:55 PM).
Checked Ph - 6.14 EC - 351 PPM (8:46:16 PM)


Man Dude If You Did All That In One Day???,,,You Are Putting Way To Much Stuff In Your Res, & It Can't Stablelize Because You Keep adding Thing & Changing The Mix!!!!!

Like I Said Way Back, You Need To Get On A Schedule & Stick With It.

__________________

Hatch,

Look at the starting PPM's. It was at 89. There were not nutes left in the res! I added two shots (two teaspoons of FloraNova) earlier which raised the PPM's to 297. I did some reading and based on the age of the plants I bumped up the nutes by one teaspoon which increased the PPM's to 739. Six hours later the PPM's dropped to 351 and the Ph rose to 6.14. Apparently the plants are good to go on the nutrient front but I'm lost at this point. Aren't you supposed to keep a consistent PPM going on? Or should you allow for a few days without nutes?

That's what I'm attempting to do by recording the data. I asked you and Toke earlier for some help in that area (by way of my last post in my grow journal) but none of my concerns or questions were answered. I need some help, that's the reason for these posts.

Thanks,

-The Corsican.

P.S.,

6951A,

The plants are a little over a month into veg. Check out my grow journal and look at the pics I posted a day or so ago. I'm thinking the rust spots might be a mag deficiency but like Hatch said, I need to get a handle on my Ph and smooth things out.

__________________
My grow journal: http://www.greenpassion.org/f24/cors...st-grow-15533/

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke.

"If at first you don't succeed, it wont hurt to smoke a little weed!"

I'm Sorry If We Missed Your ???, I Will Go Back & Find It, I Know That A Small Res Is Harder To Keep Stable With Several Plants In It, Just A Thought, Is There Any way You Could Add A Bigger Res That They All Feed Out Of???

With My 20gal Res. I Just Have To Top Off & Add Nuts Every Third Day, Then Res Changes Every 14 Days.

__________________

After looking at your plants, I would say that the largest, healthiest looking plant is going to be wanting more PPMs than you are feeding it. The plants with the spotting on the lower leaves, look like they had some mobile nutrient def. (possible Mg), but I wouldn't say they want necessarily more than 750 ppms.


I really don't know the nutrient line you are running, but if this was my grow, I would bring the PPMs up into the low 800s, and make sure they had a good source of Cal/mag/iron (like for example CAL/MAG+).


How do the root systems on the smaller plants look? Good?



I would also move that largest plant into its own bucket, but having plants being different sizes in a fixed, single res hydro system always bugged me.

Hatch,

Sorry, I'm just frustrated right now, plus I sent private messages to both of you and never really heard much after that. I can't really run a larger res or I'll wind up losing a few inches of much needed vertical space. It adds up quick one you put a light on top of the plants. Okay, so it's alright to go a day or three with low PPMs and then dose the plants with nutes?

6951A, (man that tag screws with me!)

I planned on buying some CalMag+ in the next few days, thanks. The roots look very nice. I'm using FloraNova (grow plus micro nutes in one bottle).

-the Corsican.

__________________
My grow journal: http://www.greenpassion.org/f24/cors...st-grow-15533/

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke.

"If at first you don't succeed, it wont hurt to smoke a little weed!"

Bro I Understand, & Very Sorry If I Didn't Answer Your PM's???,,I Try To Get To All Of Them As Soon As I Can.

I Can Go Every Third Day In My Bigger Res'zzz, With Your Smaller Ones You Might Need To Go Every Other Day, & Yes The Goal Is To Keep A Constant PPM Level, But With Your Plants Being Active It Would Be Hard, So If You Replace Them Every Other Day That Should Keep Them Happy.

Remember That This Is All A Learning Experience, & You Will Learn To Read Your Plant & Know What They Need In Time, You Are Doing Fine, Just Relax & Let Them Grow.

__________________

I Found This For Ya, Maybe This Can Explain Some Things For Ya way Better Then I Can Try.
PREPARING NUTRIENT SOLUTIONS
Always follow the instructions on the products and dilute to the strength that best suits your strain. All you need is a container in which to mix the nutrient solution and the nutrients themselves. Each of the packs should have A, B and C written on them and this method of tagging is used to calculate the mixture instruction on the label. A usually represents the primary nutrients, B the secondary nutrients and C the micronutrients. In some cases, A represents the vegetative food, B the flowering food and C either the secondary nutrients or a secondary and micronutrient mixture. Check your pack for specific details.
In most cases the mixture is about 3.5 ml of each (A, B and C) per liter of water. This is called a 100 percent strength mixture if you follow the instructions on the pack.
Hydroponic pH
After you have mixed your nutrient solution you\'ll want to take a pH reading of it.
Just as in soil growing, you may need to adjust your pH level; however you do not adjust pH to the same levels. For hydroponics, you will need a pH up and pH down adjusting solution. These are relatively inexpensive and can be added to your solution to balance the pH level. Cannabis plants in a soil system like a pH of 7, but in hydroponic systems they like a pH of 5.2 to 6.3. You\'ll discover it is easier to maintain a pH range than a set level. Check your hydroponic pH level as often as you can, as the pH level can change very quickly in hydroponic systems.

\'«« ———-^•CKM.™
pH UP m PH DOWN
pH up and pH down products for hydroponic use.
Algae

Algae is part of a large group of non-vascular, mainly aquatic cryptogams capable of photosynthesis. Always keep your container away from exposure to direct light, as algae will grow if you do not. Most hydroponic kits are manufactured to be lightproof* to eliminate this problem. If you built your own system, like the bubbler described later in this chapter, then you will want to keep your solution sealed from the light using thick black tape to cover the lid and the entire reservoir. This will help prevent algae from growing in your system. A thick, black garbage bag also works well to keep the light out and algae from forming.
If you notice algae growth then you will need to clean your system. Wash the unit and replace the nutrient solution with a fresh mix. Throw out all old algae-infested nutrients. Also try to find the source of the light leak and patch it up.
Grow and Bloom
Some of the double nutrient packs come in two different sets: grow and bloom. The grow solution is used during the plants\' vegetative growth stage and the bloom is used during the flowering stage. The bloom formulas contain more phos phorus and potassium and less nitrogen. Other packs have a complete all-in-one function, but beware; they may lack important nutrients or minerals.
A Word about Nutrient Strengths
When nutrients are mixed at full strength, cannabis has a tendency to suffer from chemical burn. It\'s suggested that when using any hydroponic formulations with cannabis you do so in moderation for your first grow. Many cannabis growers have bought these products anticipating the production of great big buds only to get great big plant burns.
In fact, even medium-strength formulas have the power to burn your plants. Consult the information on the packs, but in general 3.5 ml of A, B and C per liter is called 100 percent strength. The same amount mixed with two liters or of water is 50 percent strength. Marijuana can grow very well with nutrient solutions of between 30 and 50 percent. It\'s best to start off with 30 percent strength and then increase as needed. You\'ll be surprised at how rich a bud content you\'ll produce with a nutrient strength of only 30 percent.
The most common problem associated with hydroponics is plant burns. I have rarely heard of anyone underfeeding plants in a hydro system. I have heard plenty of reports about overfeeding plants in hydro systems. Over time you\'ll get to know your strain and what it likes. The better you know your strain the better you\'ll be able to control the feeding amounts.
CONTROLLING THE HYDROPONIC ENVIRONMENT Monitoring Recycle Systems
Depending on the setup you\'re using, you may find it beneficial to recycle your water and nutrient solution. As the plants extract nutrients and minerals from the solution it will be depleted of its resources over time. For this reason we must understand how to monitor nutrients so that we know when to recycle and when to replace the solution. Monitoring systems are a bit expensive. If you have a pip reader, also known as a total dissolved solids (TDS) meter, you can understand how much of your nutrients have been used and how much more you need to add to reach the optimal nutrient level. All reservoirs will become unbalanced and need replenishing. As a general rule, an initial amount is used to fill the reservoir. As the plants use up the solution, top up the reservoir to maintain a constant, appropriate level. If you start with 10 gallons of solution then you need to top up to that total of 10 gallons every few days.
If you don\'t have a pip reader you can still grow a good crop using hydroponics, but it takes practice to get it right. If a hydroponic grower doesn\'t have a pip reader they tend to replace the reservoir more often instead of topping it up. That way the grower is certain that the new solution contains everything the plants need. If you have a pip reader, you only need to top off the reservoir as needed. These readers can be expensive, but over time they\'ll help save money on the cost of pricey hydroponic nutrients.
Hard Water Problems
Hard water is the most common problem found in domestic water supplies. Water is classified as \'hard\' if it contains minerals other than H20 in amounts above 1 G PG (grain per gallon). Soft water contains minerals other than H20 in amounts below 1 GPG. Very hard water reaches levels above 7 GPG.
If you observe scales forming in your reservoir or what looks like kettle rust then you haven\'t been maintaining your pH level in the correct range. Minerals will build up into grains in the solution causing it to become \'hard\'. Your local water company can provide you with a readout on your water. You can also buy nutrient products to use with hard water. If scaling persists just drain and clean your reservoir and mix a new batch of nutrients to the correct pH level. Some growers use a reverse osmosis water-filtering system to clean their tap water, producing distilled water that has a stable pH level of 7.0.
When to Add More Nutrients
Beginners should rely on a ppm meter, but a veteran grower learns to read the plant. The plant will reveal if it is has too much, too little or just enough nutrients. It takes a few grows to learn to read the plant and this is part of growing experience. The plant may have siphoned all the nutrients or just some of them. Some nutrients are taken up by the plant and stored until it needs more. A top up can be done if you don\'t want to change the reservoir completely.
If you don\'t have a ppm meter to calculate nutrient levels accurately, simply record your nutrient mix ratio from day one. Let\'s say you used 3.5 ml of A, B and C in a one-liter container, [f the plant has used 1/2 liter, all you need is to make another liter of 3.5-ml mix in another container and add 1/2 of that to the reservoir. This is a simple way of doing it, but you\'re left with 1/2 liter of solution. By doing your math and making a mixing chart, you can mix different amounts as needed. Every now and again you will need to mix a fresh batch of nutrient because topping up becomes increasingly inaccurate over a period of time.
AFFORDABLE HYDROPONICS
Growing using hydroponics is not rocket science. It\'s a simple process that varies slightly depending on what kind of setup you choose. Most of the nutrient mixes are explained on the packs. If you follow the instructions and remember that cannabis only needs 30 to 50 percent strength nutrients then you\'ll do just fine.
Over the years, many cannabis cultivators have experimented by building their own growing contraptions. There are more than 100 different types of systems that can be handmade at home. Out of these 100, about 15 are ideal for cannabis. One of the most famous and simplest systems is DWC (deep water culture), also known as the bubbler. This system is very cheap to assemble and yet still provides excellent growth rates. There\'s nothing like it for the price and it can be quite a rewarding way to grow.
The Bubbler
The bubbler is simply an all-in-one nutrient and plant holding container with a lid and a pump, but it produces extraordinary results! Using the bubbler method, you can produce optimal growing conditions for top yielding strains, as long as it is maintained and managed well, by you, the grower.
The Bubble Bucket
1. Get a container that can hold roughly 3 gallons of nutrients per plant. For a double bubbler use a container that can hold 6 gallons. For a single plant you can use a 3 gallon bucket. Make sure that the container comes with a lid.
2. Wrap the entire unit and lid with black gaffer tape. This will keep light out of the unit and prevent alga from forming in the nutrient solution.
3. Get some 6-inch net pots.
4. Cut circular holes in the lid, enough to allow the entire net pot to rest fully down into the lid. The rim of the net pot should be enough to keep it from slipping into the container totally.
5. Cut a hole in the bottom of the container. Insert a small valve in here and use some waterproof sealing around the sides. A good glue will work too. Make sure that the valve can accommodate the pump\'s air tube without leaking.
6. Insert the pump\'s air tube into the valve.
7. Attach an air stone to the air tube inside the container. Let it rest on the bottom somewhere around the middle of the container.
8. Attach the air tube to your pump.
9. Fill the container with your nutrient solution just so that it covers about an inch of the bottom of the net pot.
10. Get your growing medium together - rockwool, clay pebbles, and place these into the net pots.
11. Transplant your rooted clone to the net pot
12. Fill up the remaining area of the net pots with more clay pebbles to support the clones.
13. Turn on your air pump 24-hours a day. That\'s all there is to it!

__________________

Thanks Hatch,

Nice post. I fell asleep early last night so I apologize for the belated post. One question I do have is about adjusting Ph. Let's say I check my Ph and it's 6.4, is it alright to take it to 5.4 in one shot or should it be done slowly, over a few hours?

Thanks man,

-the Corsican.

__________________
My grow journal: http://www.greenpassion.org/f24/cors...st-grow-15533/

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke.

"If at first you don't succeed, it wont hurt to smoke a little weed!"

Yes, That Would Be Okay.