need some help from the resident hydro masters... - GreenPassion.org - Dedicated to Medicinal Cannabis Cultivation and Education

The Corsican · #1 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 07:36 PM

Hello,

I just built a Bubbler that I will eventually turn into a "Bubbleponics unit" by adding a pump and irrigation hub to the root zone but for now I just built myself a plain old DWC Bubbler.

I have a few plants that I just transplanted into the DWC bubbler about an hour or so ago. They are small and growing slowly. They were in miniature Hempy cups (Soda bottles). The sucker leaves have dried up and will probably fall off very soon. Does this mean I should now be giving them nutrients even though they all seem like runts?

So far everything has been decent environmentally. Good temps, decent ventilation, no over watering, etc. The only thing that I can come up with concerning the slow growth and puny size of these seedlings is the genetics. The seedlings are from low grade bag seed and I'm guessing they are Sativa dominant but maybe someone else will chime in and give me an opinion?

Here are some pics:

As you can see the sucker leaves are dried up and about to fall off. The plants are small and growing slowly. I'm hoping they will fair better in my newly built Bubbler. Take a look at the leaves and tell me what you guys think is going on. I'm hoping Toke and Hatch will chime in and give me some expert advice.

Picture number six is of a newly sprouted seedling (about four or five days old I guess) and it's looking better than all the others did when they were the same age. I have two other seedlings that look pretty much like this little gal. I also have one weak looking seedling/sprout and one plant that is the same age as the "larger" (Hmmph!) seedlings. I have no idea what is going on.

I'm basically wondering if it is time to start my grow nutes. I have FF Grow big but I bought the wrong bottle before I really knew any better. It is the 6-4-4 concentrated formula.

Thanks for the help and advice,

-the Corsican.

tokecrazy · #2 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 09:22 PM

Hey C,after they have two set of leave start the nutr at a low PPM about 200 to 300 PPM'S.If they are clones they can start out at a higher PPM.The mother was feed so they will want food to after rooting.In your pixs they look to be ready for nutr all but one or two of them.Did you germ the seeds before putting them the RR-plugs or just put the seed in?Looks as if the seeds didn't get pushed into the plugs deep enough so the stem is a little puny looking.They need to be deep in the plugs it will help support them better.Poke a pencil down the hole to deepen it if needed next time.Especially if they are clone cutting.Do watch the PH and the water temps.To high water temp slow growth.The set up looks real good nice job.FF nutr are good nutr,I use the GH 3-part.They are cheaper and do the same job very well too.Just check the FF nutr charts to see what they say on how much to use. Peace

The Corsican · #3 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 10:06 PM

Thanks Toke.

I realized the mistake I made with RR plugs. The second set of seeds I put in the plugs are looking better because I put them into the plugs a bit deeper. Picture number six (last pic) is a seedling that started off deeper in the plugs and it looks a lot healthier than the rest, so do her two sisters that aren't shown in the pics. None of these are clones, just slow growth and very puny in my opinion. I expect them to beef up in the next week or two, God willing.

I don't have a PPM/EC meter at the moment, any idea how I should keep things rolling without one?

Thanks for the advice,

-the Corsican.

tokecrazy · #4 (**permalink**) 09-29-2009, 10:38 PM

Hey HidHut has a milwaukee pH600 meter for $25.00 and it's a good one.I have one and an oakton meter.Call HidHut and talk to juston and let him know this is your first hydro grow and he may toss in a sample pack of PH calibration solution with the meter.You could get the ph strips that they use in swining pools. That' about it. Peace

The Corsican · #5 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 12:27 AM

Excellent, thanks for the heads up.

Unfortunately I'm not sure when I'll have some cash but as soon as I get a little I'll give him a call.

Thanks,

-the Corsican.

Lumix · #6 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 12:43 AM

My conservative numbers

Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
Early Vegging 300 to 400
Full Vegetation 450 to 700
Early Blooming 750 to 950
Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600

Here's mine Toke know's his stuff

The Corsican · #7 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:05 AM

Nice setup Lumix!

What strains are you working with or are you growing from bag seed? I'm really hoping my girls will show a vast improvement after transplanting them into the bubbler. I just dosed them with some nutes, a weak solution. My res is a 14 gallon but I figure it has about 11 gallons in it at the current water level. I really need to get a EC meter so I know what my PPM's are.

I know there's a formula out there for what a teaspoon or CCs equal in PPMs and I think I might have it somewhere in my Cannabis Cultivation folder. I didn't add very much, probably something like two teaspoons of Grow Big. I want to see how they react to it in the next 24 hours. If things look good in two days I'll bump it up to quarter strength and so on and so forth. My Ph is right a 6.0.

-the Corsican.

Lumix · #8 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Corsican

Nice setup Lumix!

What strains are you working with or are you growing from bag seed? I'm really hoping my girls will show a vast improvement after transplanting them into the bubbler. I just dosed them with some nutes, a weak solution. My res is a 14 gallon but I figure it has about 11 gallons in it at the current water level. I really need to get a EC meter so I know what my PPM's are.

I know there's a formula out there for what a teaspoon or CCs equal in PPMs and I think I might have it somewhere in my Cannabis Cultivation folder. I didn't add very much, probably something like two teaspoons of Grow Big. I want to see how they react to it in the next 24 hours. If things look good in two days I'll bump it up to quarter strength and so on and so forth. My Ph is right a 6.0.

-the Corsican.

Growing Killing Fields and Kali Mist, Emmm yum yum

Careful with the baby's, you know how they can turn away and say '"no"
If they burn, flush the system and start over fresh.

The Corsican · #9 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:32 AM

Right on.

To be honest it's been about seven hours, give or take an hour and the girls are looking a bit better already. I'm not sure if it's wishful thinking or self deception but damn if they don't look a bit more perky! The next 24-48 hours is going to be critical for them. The reason I started off with a very low dose of nutes is because there is a fresh seedling in the bubbler. I wanted to see if the growth will speed up compared to those miniature Hempy cups I was growing in.

I need another air pump. I built a second DWC Bubbler out of a 2 gallon bucket and I'd like to get my other two nice looking seedlings in it as soon as possible. When I transplanted out of the hempies I noticed that the roots had just about reached the res in the Hempy cups. It took about two weeks for them to reach it but I'm wondering if they would have shot up? I still have another one still in a Hempy cup so I'll know for sure in a few days.

-the Corsican.

The Corsican · #10 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:33 AM

Someone take a look at the discoloration on the leaves of my plants and tell me what you think is going on. I'm thinking a N deficiency and maybe a Mag deficiency but what do I know, this is my first grow.

Thank you,

-the Corsican.

Hatch · #11 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:49 AM

The Corsican

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permalink
Hey Hatch,

Excellent post.

I have a question about Rapid Rooter plugs since I'm using them. You said that you ditch the plugs...

..."(i will only use rapid rooter plugs if i have to start seeds, & as soon as they can be cloned, i loose the plug)"...

Because you are growing using aeroponics? Why do you loose the plugs exactly? What are the pros and cons of using RR plugs in Hydro (and using hydroton as a grow medium)?

I've got all my seedlings in RR plugs and I'm wondering how you can "loose the plugs" since the root system is extensively interwoven into the plugs?
Later today or later this morning I'm going to start a thread in the Hydro section because I have a lot of important questions. I hope you'll be willing to help me out by answering them? You and Toke are the resident Hydro experts and though I'm very competent with my hands (good at building things no matter the genre) I'm still very new to Hydroponics and have loads to learn about it.

I appreciate the help. I'll be posting pictures so you can see what I'm working with.

Thanks,

-the Corsican.

See There Here We Go!!!EH!!!
Okay The Deal About The Hydroton Is They Break Off Little Pieces & The Dust Off Of Them Adds Up In The Res & Can Stop up The Filter's, & If They Get By The Filter Clog Up The Mister's, Or If You Have Drip Lines Clog Them Up, It Can Be A On Going Problem. Some May Use Them With Great Success & Really Like Them, I Feel They Are Mess, & Not Necessary, Just Something Else To Have To Buy & Stay On Top Of. I Have Great Success With Just A 2" Basket & 2" Neoprene No Other Kinda Medium.

This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 1024x515.

About Rapid Starter Plugs, If You Are Going To Use A Plug, They Are The Ones To Use. With That Said, You Have To Watch Them About Staying To Wet All The Time, If You Were To Just Start From Seed Then Veg Abit Then Flower The Plant You Should Be Okay, But If You Plan For It To Be A Mom/Donor & Keep It Alive Along Time, It Will Develop Root Rot Where The Stem Is in The Plug.

When I Said I Would Ditch Or Loose The Plug, I Was Speaking Hypothetically And Of Things I Have Done In & Experienced In The Past, But If I Started A Seed In A Rapid Rooter Plug After It Got To 6" I Would Clone It (just into a 2" basket & neoprene) And Then Flower What Was Left Of The Seedling, Female Or Male???,,Would Determine What Happened Next, But Basically As Soon As It Has Ran It's Course I Would Get The Plugs Out Of The System.
I Have Never Done It, But I Feel Strongly That I Could Do It, But If I Germinated Some Seeds In Some Paper Towels And Let Them Get A Good Tap Root, I Feel I Could Put Them Straight Into Just A Neoprene & Basket And Into The Aero-Bubbler-Ponic Pods And Start From There, I Don't Know If I Would Try This On Seeds I'm Going To Order From Sannies Or TGA, But I Just Might!!!LOL!!!

Give You Plants A Little Time In The New Set-Up, & Do What Toke Was Telling Ya, & I Think They Will Bounce Back..
Check Ya Later..Cheers`;`Hatch`;`

The Corsican · #12 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 01:58 AM

Hey Hatch,

Thanks for the advice. Did you look at the leaves on my plants? I'm curious as to what is going on with them. I'm thinking a N deficiency and a Mag deficiency. Since none have gotten nutes I figure they're starving. I just added a very weak nute solution mixed in water, Ph'd out to 6.0 which seems decent and then added it to the res.

I can't wait to get some cash so I can buy some good genetics and get some good lights for flowering. I still have some time so hopefully the cash will fall from the sky at the perfect moment.

Thanks for the confidence boost brother!

-the Corsican.

Hatch · #13 (**permalink**) 09-30-2009, 02:33 AM

Ya They Weren't Doing Very Good In The Hempy Cups, Give Them A Few Days Know That You Have Give Them A Small Dose, Then Look At The new Growth, & Don't Worry About The Older Leaves.

The Corsican · #14 (**permalink**) 10-03-2009, 07:33 AM

Hey Hatch (and everyone else paying attention),

It's been four days, my girls are on 1/3 nutes and they are doing very nicely. No shock from the transplant into the DWC Bubbler and the leaves and growth look very healthy.

I'll be updating my grow journal in the grow journal section of the forum some time today or this evening and will have pictures to show the differences between the way I was growing and the way I'm growing now (Hydro).

-the Corsican.

P.S.,

Hatch,

Temps have risen to 85 and I just went with it for a day. I'm bringing the temps back down to 82 today to see if I can notice any difference in growth. Is 85 just too hot or is it strain dependent like I've been thinking?

Lumix · #15 (**permalink**) 10-03-2009, 08:02 AM

This is how I move a plant from a bubble reservoir to 5 gal buckets with ease.
Cut the bottom out of a 6" basket cover, drop the plant that's in a 5" basket in the 6"

The Corsican · #16 (**permalink**) 10-03-2009, 08:08 AM

That's pretty cool.

I've never seen net pots that are 5 gallon bucket tops. Pretty cool, pretty neat.

-the Corsican.

Hatch · #17 (**permalink**) 10-03-2009, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Corsican

Hey Hatch (and everyone else paying attention),

It's been four days, my girls are on 1/3 nutes and they are doing very nicely. No shock from the transplant into the DWC Bubbler and the leaves and growth look very healthy.

I'll be updating my grow journal in the grow journal section of the forum some time today or this evening and will have pictures to show the differences between the way I was growing and the way I'm growing now (Hydro).

-the Corsican.

P.S.,

Hatch,

Temps have risen to 85 and I just went with it for a day. I'm bringing the temps back down to 82 today to see if I can notice any difference in growth. Is 85 just too hot or is it strain dependent like I've been thinking?

I Hope You Are Talking Air Temps & Not Res Temps?? If It Is Air Temps Many Will Say They Have Grow In This & That With No Problem, IMO From 78*f. To 85*f. They Grow Fine, When They Get Higher Then This You Start To See Things Happening In The 90*f. Can Cause Hermi's & Or Slow The Daily Growth.
Res. Temps Work Best Around 65*f. To 72*f...

The Corsican · #18 (**permalink**) 10-04-2009, 06:54 AM

Hehe!

Yes, air temps.

I think I'm going to wait until Wensday to update my grow Journal. I figure a week will be great contrast. They are growing nicely though, much better than I expected. Hydro is the way to go.

-the Corsican.

Hatch · #19 (**permalink**) 10-04-2009, 05:54 PM

Good Deal, Glad They Are Doing Better, Will Check Ya Later..